This successful American screenwriter of comedies, many of which are remakes or adaptations of novels (i.e., “Brewster’s Millions” 1985, “Pure Luck” 1991), had worked in collaboration with Timothy Harris. The Wisconsin-born Herschel A. Weingrod and his British-born partner have generally met with commercial approval for their efforts like “Twins” (1988) and “Kindergarten Cop” (1990), both of which benefited from headliner Arnold Schwarzenegger.
“Falling Down” (1993), which they co-produced, also became a box-office success, but their only real critical success to date has been “Trading Places” (1983), which paired Dan Aykroyd and Eddie Murphy.
He has written and co-written a number of Hollywood blockbusters including Space Jam with fellow writer Timothy Harris.
Enjoy my conversation with Herschel Weingrod.
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Herschel Weingrod 0:00
A lot of people say right what you know. Wrong. What did Shakespeare know about Verona? or something's rotten in Denmark? You think he spent a lot of time in Denmark? Or The Merchant of Venice? Was he like, did some research? I don't think so. No, don't write what you know about right what you care about.
Alex Ferrari 0:25
This episode is brought to you by Bulletproof Script Coverage, where screenwriters go to get their scripts read by Top Hollywood Professionals. Learn more at covermyscreenplay.com. I'd like to welcome to the show, Herschel Weingrod. How you doin Herschel?
Herschel Weingrod 0:40
Thank you very much. I'm doing well.
Alex Ferrari 0:42
Thank you so much. I appreciate you coming on the show my friend I was telling you before you single handedly covered a lot of my childhood favorites in films as a screenwriter, and as a producer, all through the 80s and 90s. So I first of all, thank you. And we'll talk about those films as we continue our conversation. But man, you you were you were hitting them out of the park pretty heavily.
Herschel Weingrod 1:07
Yeah. My writing partner, Tim Harris and I, we had a really nice, long run
Alex Ferrari 1:14
Without without question. So my first goal for my first question to you is, how did you get started in this business? And why in God's green earth did you want to get into this business?
Herschel Weingrod 1:23
Yeah, well, actually, it's kind of a negative goal, because wanting to be a screenwriter is like wanting to be a co pilot. Because you don't really get to fly the plane.
Alex Ferrari 1:37
But it's really great. And now I've never heard that analogy and many, many conversations I've never heard. That's a beautiful analogy.
Herschel Weingrod 1:43
You can use it whenever you want. So as an undergraduate, I actually majored in European history. And then around my senior year, I realized, Oh, what am I going to do with this degree? Rome the stacks of some historical library and write some historical books and teach Oh, yeah, I could be a professor great, really exciting. So actually, around my junior year, I, I began to take as many film courses as I could, this was at University of Wisconsin Madison. And then they didn't offer a lot, but they offered me some and then I started to apply to film schools, for F for postgraduate work. And I, it's a long story, but I was accepted at the London Film School in England. Nice. So I didn't know anybody there, of course. So I go there and my instructors are. Mike Lee,
Alex Ferrari 2:55
You have read my mind. I was like I said, Mike Lee,
Herschel Weingrod 2:57
Mike Lee, Charles Creighton, who did Fish Called Wanda and all those great Ealing comedies. Clive Donner who did What's New Pussycat. Guy, Hamilton, who did two of the first three Bond films with Sean Connery. And I had I had all these great instructors. So that's that was a great school because it's basically a trade school, you had to learn how to do everything. It's not an academic school where you were you were you had to write exams you had to actually perform, you had to learn how to operate the camera, load the camera, be a producer, cut sound, cut film, do everything. So then what you do is then you try to focus on whatever makes you happiest, whatever you think you're really good at. So I actually wanted to be a DP. But there's no apprenticeship program for becoming a cinematographer in Los Angeles. The ASC doesn't have like a Oh,
Alex Ferrari 4:01
It's not a standard one. It's a unofficial one that you have a lot of along the way,
Herschel Weingrod 4:07
Right. So after I, so I was in London for about three, three and a half years and then I came to I came to Los Angeles, and I realized that the only way I could get in was to write my way in to the film industry. So I was writing, I was trying to write mysteries, thrillers, film noir, all the movies that I that I like to see, okay. You know, Chinatown ish, Three Days of the Condor ish stories like that. So I, I was really fortunate because I had a neighbor who worked at British law and EMI, and they were making the deer hunter, the driver and convoy and all those movies while I was working there. So what I would go on a Monday morning to their office and I pick up a stack of scripts and manuscripts and novels and plays. And by the following Monday, I would have to write complete coverage on all of them. Now, of course, I'm 24 years old, all I want to do is get through the week, so I could go enjoy the weekend. But every once in a while I'm reading something that regardless of what the subject matter was, the writer has gotten me to want to turn the page and see what happens next. So I'm thinking, Ah, if I can learn how to do that, because you see, that's called the craft of screenwriting. Because if you're an aspiring writer, a first time writer, you have to get your script by a reader like me, at a well educated 2425 year old, who just wants to get through the batch of scripts and get to the freakin weekend. So, learning how to do transitions learning how to set things up without I mean, this is before all those rules and all those books before. Before Syd field and and certainly all those other guys save the cat and all that stuff. Right? Well, all those guys with the the inciting incident in the mid second act climax and this has to happen on page X, Y and Z. No, no, I, I actually learned that. That Every story needs to find its own way to be told otherwise. Otherwise, we wouldn't have we would never have a Charlie Kaufman.
Alex Ferrari 7:05
Well, I mean, you're talking about someone on the outside outskirts of Italy,
Herschel Weingrod 7:13
Right! But I mean, all of those all those. All those rules are rules how to write the next blockbuster? Which, as a first time writer, you're you're you're not gonna get to write any of the mission impossibles
Alex Ferrari 7:27
No. Herschel stopped that you need to tell me you're not going to get the next Marvel movie coming right out of school or no. Go to school.
Herschel Weingrod 7:37
I've never even gotten a hint of a Marvel movie assignment. Exactly.
Alex Ferrari 7:43
Because not even a shorts that even an episode of one of the shows
Herschel Weingrod 7:47
Because because those aren't written they're actually manufactured nobody comes out that's a damn what a great script that was.
Alex Ferrari 7:56
The only one if I'm if I may. I may is Winter Soldier, which was as close to if you remember Winter Soldier, Captain America's went to so that was like an espionage film. It was like it was probably one of the best written out of all Yeah, but you but you're right. Like you don't go like holy cow. That's you get an Oscar this year. Like it's not it's not, you know, it's what it is.
Herschel Weingrod 8:21
That a subtext was so strong I could tell. I could tell right away.
Alex Ferrari 8:26
But look, but that's but they don't, but they put that to popcorn movies. And that's what they're supposed to do. And they're fond and all that
Herschel Weingrod 8:33
Those are all those are all guilty pleasures, which actually make the industry a lot of money and keep it going so that more interesting films might eventually get made. So I unless I mean, I was I was basically working in the studio system and nobody would make those movies today. I mean,
Alex Ferrari 8:53
Oh, no, anything in the 70s would get made today. The Godfather, would it get financed by it's no. Nothing, nothing in the 70s 80s and 90s. Other than Batman.
Herschel Weingrod 9:07
Okay, so So look, look. No Hal Ashby movie, whatever get made. No, no being there? No, no Scorsese's No. Sidney Lumet. No One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest on my day, so you can forget all those. Oh, and those were those were brilliant studio films. Five, five easy pieces
Alex Ferrari 9:31
Forget it, but that was but that was those were the times that those movies were made. And yeah, and we're still in there still going back and mining those old IPs to remake them. Of course back up because that's when they were when you were free to be creative. But now it's just such a corporate machine that I mean, look right now you pull Marvel movies out of the theaters in 2022. Other than Top Gun right and and possibly avatar Well, more than likely avatar when it comes out later this year. There's no theatrical, there's just nothing. Like, great. There's just not no one's going to the theaters to go see a romantic comedy anymore. And it's just, it's just very, very like pretty woman today would not be a theatrical release, it'd be a Netflix film.
Herschel Weingrod 10:21
Well, actually, what do you think you'd have to Okay, so they tried to do a Broadway adaptation. The problem is, you see, you can't you, you, you, you can't have a hooker with a heart of gold at the center of a movie or a play because women won't stand for it anymore. Today, today, today, they won't know. They won't.
Alex Ferrari 10:48
But but for whatever reason, in 91, I think what was the 91? It was a Disney movie.
Herschel Weingrod 11:01
Well, that's true. Gary Marshall.
Alex Ferrari 11:03
It was a touchstone film. Yeah. And you but Gary just handled that. So absolutely beautifully. It was just remarkable. But you look, go back and look at and go, Hmm, that's not going to fly today. But I know, a lot of things wouldn't fly today. Most things in the 80s and 90s wouldn't fly today.
Herschel Weingrod 11:22
I agree. I agree.
Alex Ferrari 11:24
No, but that's where great, great cinema, you know, a lot of the Great Cinema, the 70s 80s and 90s was because we still had filmmakers running the studios. That's what they were. And they were making small movies. You know, they were making $20 million movies. They're making $30 million movies. Now that's craft services.
Herschel Weingrod 11:44
Now that's the dedicated COVID supervise,
Alex Ferrari 11:48
Pretty much pretty much Yeah, that's exactly what that is. It's it's the world has changed so much. Which brings me to your to your your filmography, which is it's such a wonderful. There's so much love in those films that you made. And you wrote, starting with Trading Places, which was a little young, young guy, comedian. How old was he like 22 or 33? He was let's say he was a kid. And trading places would never get me today. Oh, Nana million. You could still try to throw Kevin Hart in the rock in there. It's still not. It's just
Herschel Weingrod 12:29
Because I mean, we actually had a note from Paramount then, which would be the note today, which is, wait a minute. Why is he pretending to be a Vietnam to be a crippled, legless Vietnam? I mean, is he you know, like that Adam Sandler guy was trying to get money so his grandma can be put in the home or his sister can get an iron lung. So they asked us, and we said, No. The the audience doesn't care what happened before the movie started. They only care about what happens next. So it doesn't matter why he's doing it. That's not what his character is about.
Alex Ferrari 13:13
The thing that I find so beautiful about trading places and for it for all the youngins. Look at listening right now, Google Trading Places Google Eddie Murphy and Dan Ackroyd and Google that please. And then you'll have a reference point. But what I love about trading places was it was not only it wasn't I don't know if it was Eddie's was that his first? Second? There was one thing something else right was that was
Herschel Weingrod 13:39
The one he did with Nick Knowles. Walter 48 hours Excuse me. 48 hours came out first,
Alex Ferrari 13:44
First, right, but then Trading Places came out and then that was where Eddie just,
Herschel Weingrod 13:47
And then it's number one, number one, Leo's cop and all those things.
Alex Ferrari 13:50
Number one, number one, number one Number one, like I think nine movies straight. He was number one every time he came out, but what I love about trading places is that and this is something that was so so much more done than than it is now in writing films is that there's such a social commentary. That's right in trading places. That is It's subtle but yet slightly heavy handed in certain places, which I love. And but at the end it's hidden behind all the comedy of the genius of Dan accurate and and Eddie Murphy. And and Jamie Lee Curtis and everything. Yeah, I mean, the casting was fantastic. Oh, the casting was fantastic. That
Herschel Weingrod 14:31
Alex Ferrari 14:33
Herschel Weingrod 14:34
Jesus. It was just such Jim Belushi.
Alex Ferrari 14:36
It was amazing. What a Grammy what an amazing cast. But I wasn't wanting to ask you since you worked and you have worked with a lot of amazing improvisers over the years. Sure How much of that script was Eddie just being Eddie and how much it was you guys writing?
Herschel Weingrod 14:56
I would say that 90 90% of what's on the screen, at least, was on the page. Now what but, but what was but what was great was You see, this is unheard of. They had a week of rehearsal.
Alex Ferrari 15:14
Just one week of
Herschel Weingrod 15:16
Rehearsal like it's a play.
Alex Ferrari 15:18
Oh, like, oh, they
Herschel Weingrod 15:20
Actual separate from pre production. I mean, they had a week of rehearsals. So Eddie, Eddie and Danny and Jamie Lee and all those characters. They're like, running lines, and then they're riffing and, and they came up with stuff that just made me and my partner look better. Right. And you just, I mean, we didn't write the line where he says, when they when the Duke brothers bail him out, and he gets in the in the limo, and they're doing the intros and he says, Billy Ray Valentine Capricorns. But we, but we did right? Karate man bruise on inside.
Alex Ferrari 16:09
Karate man was on the, I mean, it's me. There's so many quotable things, you know, looking good. Feeling good. Like it was last. All that there's a T shirts, like I've seen T shirts without this to this day. I still teachers saying that?
Herschel Weingrod 16:25
Well, okay, so here's this. Here's this early woke thing. So we wrote the line about when he when he brings office, all of his friends back to have a party, and they're dancing, and all of a sudden he realizes he's becoming middle class and very possessive of his new possessions. And he's saying, who put their cool out on my Persian carpet. So, okay, so So, what? People don't understand this kind of cultural context that cool menthol cigarettes were marketed primarily at black people. Yeah, in fact, most of the people who smoke cools were black people. And so black people get that joke. And white people of a certain age get the joke as well. But Paramount said, No, you can't put that thing in about the cools. No, that's no, that's that's stereotype bla bla bla bla bla. Well, seriously. So that's when we shot that scene, and he put it right back in anyway. And it was fun. And I stayed in and it stayed in, of course.
Alex Ferrari 17:37
God, I mean, when you when you did you go on set with with John and Eddie and everybody. Were you on set? Are you on set? So what was it like being on the set watching? Eddie, you could just see a superstar being born or literally, how did how did you? How does what was that? Like?
Herschel Weingrod 17:58
I could tell. Okay, let me do a little backtrack on. We had pitched trading places. We had completely worked out scene for scene basically, with lines, we could, we could pitch it in 15 to 18 minutes. And we went to the Head of Production at Warner Brothers at the time because we had something else that we brewing over there. Maybe it had been optioned, maybe it was gonna get made, they liked us. So we go into the head of production, and we pitch training places. And he says it's funny, but if I can't get Richard Pryor, who can I cast? And we said, Eddie Murphy in trading. Then on Saturday night, why this kids a genius? And he said, I don't think he's going to be a movie star.
Alex Ferrari 18:47
Of course, of course, you always hear that, you know, he's like, Oh, kid.
Herschel Weingrod 18:53
We went to paramount to have a meeting with these producers about they were pitching us the worst idea of for TV series ever. White bigot moves into a house that's haunted by a black ghost.
Alex Ferrari 19:08
Oh my God, that's horrible. Oh, no,
Herschel Weingrod 19:10
I just I look at my partner. And we said should we should we pitch them trading place if they want to? White Black story. So we pitch them trading places and they ran upstairs? They got us a deal to write it.
Alex Ferrari 19:24
Well, oh, this was on a pitch still.
Herschel Weingrod 19:27
Just as Yeah, this was okay. And then what happened was we were on the set of 48 hours. We actually saw that famous scene where in that bar where Eddie says on your white. I'm your worst nightmare.
Alex Ferrari 19:49
Yeah, maybe a new sheriff in town, right?
Herschel Weingrod 19:51
Yeah. And the N word with a badge. I'm your worst nightmare that was and then we've met them brief flea and then we hear this laughter in his trailer because he's reading Trading Places.
Alex Ferrari 20:07
Yeah. Yeah, everyone's got an impression of the golden lamp.
Herschel Weingrod 20:11
So he got it right away loved it. And you know, Dan Ackroyd was great because because he's such a generous actor that he didn't mind being an a hole for the for the first two thirds of the movie, always very, he's very smug. He's very unsympathetic. And only later he kind of turns in as a heart.
Alex Ferrari 20:39
Right. I mean, and he played it beautifully. Just so So, so beautifully. So I said, 20 places comes out. It's a mega hit, you know? And yeah, basically, and it's a huge hit at that for the time. How does the town treat you after that? I always love asking that question. What was how did what? How did the town treat you? You're like the belle of the ball all of a sudden.
Herschel Weingrod 21:04
We suddenly got a lot more offers than we had before putting calls coming in is what you're saying. We have a lot of we had a lot of meetings.
Alex Ferrari 21:12
Oh, you did the water bottle tool back then. They didn't have water bottles. They bought water bottles as much back then. But you know what I mean. But then you made then afterwards another call. I mean, a classic film that I watched as a kid. It's Brewster's millions.
Herschel Weingrod 21:25
Yeah, we did that. Next. Right with Richard with
Alex Ferrari 21:27
Richard Pryor. Yeah, exactly. What a beautifully high concept. Film, like it's just so you get it in one sentence. Correct. That you saw the sentence essentially, guy with it, but he had to spend it all on 30. Like, it's just you have to win. You see, you win, you win a million dollars, but in order to get $100 million, you got to spend a million dollars. It was so brilliant. And then Richard Pryor and Jackie, it was Jackie Gleason. Right. What? Who was is that was Jackie Gleason was his co star who was his co star. John Candy junk. Oh, no, not No, not yet. Not his partner. Who was the Wasn't there a bad guy? Who was the bad I haven't seen that movie in years. Who was the bad guy? Because I know John Candy was like his buddy. Wasn't a Gleason. I swear to God, I thought it was pleasing. Maybe in another universe.
Herschel Weingrod 22:18
The bad guys were oh, what's his name? was trying to kind of was trying to sabotage him because he kind of because he kind of wasn't Jackie girlfriend away.
Alex Ferrari 22:31
It was John. Yeah, but John Candy. So you have John Candy Richard Pryor. And then that becomes a huge because now Richard is taking off as well. And
Herschel Weingrod 22:43
Well, what was what was really great about that was, I don't want to I don't want this to be like stir crazy. Or Silver Streak, or my stand up. I don't want I don't want anything about racing it at all. I don't want it to be racial in the slightest. I don't want anyone to mention race, and I don't. So don't feel like you have to like, get out, get out my dialog or make me street or all I am is a guy who just wanted a pitch in the big leagues against the Yankees. Yes, it existed. That's great.
Alex Ferrari 23:19
You know, the thing about that movie is it is the dream, you are tapping into the dream of so many people who doesn't want to win the lottery, you know, or a version of the lotto and inheritance of some sort. They, and then and then you're forced, like, spend it all? Yes. It's such an amazing, it's kind of like, we all wish we could eat anything we want to eat and not gain any weight. Like it's extreme. Right? But not many people get the opportunity. Like I really have to eat all the all the pizza.
Herschel Weingrod 23:53
What was really, really fun was doing a bit of research to find ways creatively where he could spend a fortune and have nothing to show for it like mailing right mailing a million dollar stamp. Such a brilliant now that was that's actually a real stamp the inverted Jenny, you can look it up here. It's a real stamp. And then the guy who comes in and says, I'm going to tow an iceberg from the North Pole. And he has this great and then there's then when he runs for mayor, as none of the above vote for none of the above. Well, that was inspired. I was reading about these nuns in San Francisco banded together and they ran for political office they said vote none of the above and you end
Alex Ferrari 24:49
Ohh wow. Oh my god of God. That's that's
Herschel Weingrod 24:53
even that scene where there's train tracks running through the outside. Field. Yeah, I found that there was there was a minor league baseball field in Mexico where that actually happened every single day.
Alex Ferrari 25:12
Some of the stuff in that movie I remember like it's all coming back, like I saw it when I was fun, so much fun. And it was uncapable 1000 times movies that you just kept watching again and again and again. And again, I'll ask you the same question. What's it like working with Richard Pryor being on set with a legend a genius?
Herschel Weingrod 25:30
Oh, it's great. I mean, I mean, he was kind of he was kind of in the middle of all kinds of all kinds of other stuff. So, but he was very kind. He was very professional. He's very funny. He was on time he didn't have he didn't have this huge entourage. He didn't act like, like a big shot in storm off to his trailer.
Alex Ferrari 25:59
That's amazing. Now, another film in the 80s that you worked on, which is, again, as high concept as you get is twins.
Herschel Weingrod 26:09
Yes, of course,
Alex Ferrari 26:10
Which is? I mean, did you come up with that idea? Did you get brought into it? Or she brought into it?
Herschel Weingrod 26:17
Yeah. It was a rewrite.
Alex Ferrari 26:19
It was a rewrite. It was a rewrite deal. Because at that, I mean, Arnold Schwarzenegger, Danny DeVito are twins go!
Herschel Weingrod 26:26
Well, well, Ivan Reitman, right. Okay, I have this script written by these two English guys. It's a really good premise. I really want it, I really want to get it to Arnold and Danny, but I only have one shot. So I need it to be executed better, and tailored for them better, so that I could send it to them, and try to get them on board. And I only have one shot. So do you guys have any ideas we're reading, it was called the experiment written by these two English guys who have actually became really good friends of my writing partner. Anyway, so we're reading it and we come back and we say, you know, we can do X, Y, and Z. But basically, we can solve the one big problem. He said, What's that? He said, they have to be looking for their mommy. If they're not looking for their mommy, you don't have a story. That's the heart. That's the heart of the story. Okay, they're separated at birth, they don't know anything about anything. And then they find out about this experiment. And you know, once a genius and once the, you know, the bottom of the gene pool allegedly. And, and this light bulb goes, I mean, okay, and then they they have all these things in common and they bond and they find this thing but but then, but then after that, it's not about it's not about that MacGuffin, that's in Danny DeVito trunk that has to do with some crime that I never figured out what that was, what it's about is it's about mommy, we have to find our mother.
Alex Ferrari 28:16
And you're absolutely absolutely right. It is about it's about mommy. And again. I mean, that was a massive hit. I don't remember that in the video store. We had like 20 copies of it. It was massive it massively poster.
Herschel Weingrod 28:31
Alex Ferrari 28:35
But you talking about the biggest movie star in the world at the time, Arnold? Well, yeah, with Danny DeVito, who was a star in his own right with Ivan Reitman as the director who no slouch on his own but from what I also heard the story you tell me if it's true I'm sure it is but that the studio really didn't have a lot of confidence in the movie. And that Arnold Ivan and Danny cut a deal for a percentage of the back end which brought in an absurd like they the studio lost hundreds of
Herschel Weingrod 29:12
They worked for scale plus 10 Arnold Yes. Because the studio didn't think that people would see Arnold, Tim and a comedy and they they weren't really confident and so and actually when we heard that Ivan Arnold and Danny were were going to work for scale and just take a nice piece of the gross we said we'll do that and the studio said NO NO NO NO NO NO NO Well, writer no we can't writers writer
Alex Ferrari 29:48
That sets precedents we can't do something like that. By the way, from what I understand the studio head after everything, I forgot But then I mean, the numbers were pretty astronomical. As far as what the what they got the three. It was pretty astronomical. And the studio had afterwards basically almost lost the job. I think he's like, it's what it's like, you know, signing over the the sequel rights and merchandising for Star Wars like it's, well, it's one of those things, but then they opened that door and they slammed it shut and it never happened again. No, because it was a massive cut. It wasn't like a little bit of the back and wasn't like Tom Cruise back end or Jack Nicholson on Batman. Back end. It's so massive chocolate 50%.
Herschel Weingrod 30:37
So it was basically it was basically first dollar gross.
Alex Ferrari 30:42
On top of that. It wasn't even that it was gross. And that Oh, yeah. A lot of money.
Herschel Weingrod 30:46
Yeah, that was gross.
Alex Ferrari 30:48
So much money they made off that. But I'm good for them. And then of course you follow that up with another classic Mr. Kindergarten Cop, which is another insanely high concept. Arnold's a kindergarten teacher go.
Herschel Weingrod 31:02
Alex Ferrari 31:04
He's an undercover cop kindergarten teacher.
Herschel Weingrod 31:06
Go. That was gonna be right to that was a relate to,
Alex Ferrari 31:09
And I've been brought you guys in for that rewrite? Yeah. I have to ask, What's it like working with Ivan man, you know, you know, God rest his soul. He was just this amazing talent over the years. I mean, let's not even talk about Ghostbusters, and everything else he's done. Well, yeah, but I'm being but what was it like cuz you collaborated with multiple films? What was it like collaborating with what,
Herschel Weingrod 31:30
You know? Ivan had a very sentimental streak, which you kind of see in his films. And he and he, he also had a tendency to have, you know, multiple and earned endings. So, or multi earned multiple endings. So So what was nice about him was, you could talk him out of something interesting, you know if you know so, so he was willing to listen and collaborate. And if you could convince him that your idea would play a little better than what he had in mind. He'd say, Okay, go ahead and try it.
Alex Ferrari 32:18
So we did. That's a good collaborator. Yeah. Oh, yeah. He was great about that. That's a very good collaborator. And then, of course,
Herschel Weingrod 32:26
I mean, I mean, actually, I think he was a much better producer than he was a director. I think his son's a better director, pure and simple. But, but Ivan knew where the jokes were done, Ivan, and Ivan knew how to how to how to make a movie that would that would be very successful and very accessible at the same time. And all of his movies have heart if you will. They're all out there ultimately, very heartwarming. They're not they're not cynical. Right up. They're not I mean, even I mean, Dave is a wonderful film, by the way,
Alex Ferrari 33:06
Dave, is that it really is a matt probably on his on his filmography, one of the masterpieces that he created Dave is a wonderful film. It is it really really is Jr. was another fun one.
Herschel Weingrod 33:18
Actually, we passed on Jr.
Alex Ferrari 33:19
You said I can't write a pregnant Arnold.
Herschel Weingrod 33:23
No. I mean, we said, look, if people didn't take an audience would accept Arnold and a comedy. How do you think men and women will think of if Arnold is a pregnant guy? His male fans will hate it and women fans will just be horrified. So that we said no.
Alex Ferrari 33:48
So that bad movie gets financed today by the studio. You think that what you think that movie gets financed today by the studios, of course.
Herschel Weingrod 33:59
Curiously, when, when Arnold was making true True Lies for cameras. He he demanded that Cameron, bring us in to do a dialogue polish for him. Get those guys who wrote twins a Kindergarten Cop? I want them to write my lines. rewrite my lines. Now.
Alex Ferrari 34:23
How did that work out? Did you do that? Did you do?
Herschel Weingrod 34:26
It was fun. I mean, I mean, it was it was uncredited, but we got to work with Cameron and all those people again.
Alex Ferrari 34:36
How do you work with Cameron as a writer? Because he's our he's one of the greatest screenwriters of his day.
Herschel Weingrod 34:46
No, I mean, he was fine. He was he was fine. He was I mean, he he had he had that plane he had mockups of that plane and his office and he's showing guess all of us all a great technical stuff and
Alex Ferrari 35:02
You're there for jokes, and you're there for jokes?
Herschel Weingrod 35:04
Yeah, we're just we're just there to do a polish and he used a lot of it. He didn't use you know some of that. We just you know, we were on it for like a few weeks. It was fun.
Alex Ferrari 35:14
Oh my god, that was fun. I don't like a movie.
Herschel Weingrod 35:16
Oh, and of course, we knew Jamie Lee and right and I knew I knew Jim a little bit because I knew Linda Hamilton because I because okay, this this is six degrees from trading places. So the got one of the guys who was a location scout on Trading Places was in Philadelphia and he became Linda Hamilton's assistant on Beauty and the Beast.
Alex Ferrari 35:44
So it was so old town
Herschel Weingrod 35:46
He and I became friends and then I and then I met Linda and then I have been friends with Ron Perlman ever since.
Alex Ferrari 35:56
To small, small, small business.
Herschel Weingrod 35:58
I love to work with Ronnie Ronnie Ron Perlman is great. Well, Ron oh boy is oh, boy is one of my favorites.
Alex Ferrari 36:05
And we'll get voted with L boys is just I mean, it's a mad that those are masterpiece films. On a sidenote with Kindergarten Cop. I did get to direct when I was directing a film, Mr. Richard Tyson.
Herschel Weingrod 36:18
Oh, I love Richard
Alex Ferrari 36:20
Richard is amazing. And he still tells me to this day goes I still have it. I still have adults your age come up to me and go or not your age. Maybe younger than you will come up to me. I'm like you grew into my childhood. He was hair scary. He won't because it's not a monster. That's just a dad whose wants his kid and the mother and oh my god. Oh, my mom was much worse.
Herschel Weingrod 36:51
Do you is really scary.
Alex Ferrari 36:52
Oh, she sounds like like, Oh God, I feel like she had like it was given that kid mooch Johnson Syndrome. Like I mean, it was like, you could tell there's just such a. But yeah, Richard played that part. So well.
Herschel Weingrod 37:04
It's just from either Alabama or Louisiana, right?
Alex Ferrari 37:09
Yeah, he's out there. Yeah. And he? He did I think what his before that was three o'clock high
Herschel Weingrod 37:18
I like that.
Alex Ferrari 37:19
Yeah. Those days of those movies. And then but he's like, No, it's Kindergarten Cop to this day. I walk around and people go you because kindergarten cops one of those movies that everybody's seen. Or it's been, you know, my kids saw it the other day for the first time. And they and they were terrified by it. I'm like, No, I work with Richard. He's a nice guy. I know. But he's doing the way to taking the baby. Why is he taking the kid like it was an actor. It's an actor. I don't God don't even get me started when I had to explain to them it at that penny wise was actually an actor. And we had to like show him like I was getting made up. Oh, they were tariff there. So there was I wanted to ask you since you've worked with so many amazing collaborators, is there any lesson that sticks out over the years that you learn from any of the collaborators you've worked with? Whether director actor or other writers, lessons about writing lessons about storytelling lessons, lessons about the business,
Herschel Weingrod 38:19
I had a really long and happy collaboration with my writing partner. And one of the reasons for that was we were friends and close friends long before we ever started working together. And actually we saw the world the same way. Which is to say the same things made us laugh the same things made us sad. The same things made us angry. Okay, we have the exact same worldview. We'd like the same books. We like the same music. We'd like the same girls. We'd like to save everything. We met by accident. I was in film school in London. She was at Cambridge University. She was a published novelist while at Cambridge, obviously, not bad. And we met we met by accident in a little village in the south of Crete, where I had gone for a week or two with my English girlfriend, just to get away from the bad weather in England wanted to go to the furthest southern for this point in Europe in September where it might be still warm. So we go to this village in the south of Crete, called myrtos. On the Libyan Sea right across from North Africa there's no hotels. There's no motels you walk into a post office or some Taverna when you get off the bus and you try to have your crew can book You saying in Greek? Does anyone have a room for lead, and then suddenly somebody will come around and rent you have room in their, in a house for $50 a week and, and she went through and breakfast she said, I'll throw in breakfast. You speak to me in English, I'll speak to you in Greek, we'll both learn each other's languages. So I'm wandering around there and I walk into this little, little bar, and there's some long haired looking hippie there. It's Tim Harris, he's there with his English girlfriend. Were both Americans living in England in London, basically. And then we became friends. And then, and then we wound up back in Los Angeles, because he was actually born here. And then his novels where we're all mysteries and thrillers all just like, all of the scripts that I was writing. Exactly the same. So how did this happen? So one of his books got options. And and we're waiting around to see if we get a deal to write the script. And he said, I have this girlfriend. She works for this law firm, near the airport. All the lawyers are female. They only represent female clients who are getting divorced and suspect that their husbands are hiding their assets. So he says, I got this great idea. So you take that concept, and then you have them hire a male Private Eye to rat out his own gender by finding the hidden assets of other guys. Now, that's a funny idea. It is, and they made it. It's a really bad movie. Is it really? It was a really okay, that that was actually our first film. It's called Oh, yeah. Cheaper to keep her. Yeah. So the producer was this guy who did one of those early. Gabe Kaplan movies.
Alex Ferrari 42:23
Oh, God, Jesus. Wow. You're going back eight Kaplan? Yeah, yeah. Holy cow. So Jesus,
Herschel Weingrod 42:30
He was this he was this clothing guy from from, you know, Dallas or something. And he was sending the script around agencies and wait, he was offered George Segal and Candice Bergen.
Alex Ferrari 42:50
That would have been interesting for our scripts.
Herschel Weingrod 42:53
And he said, No, Matt Davis until the Felcher.
Alex Ferrari 42:58
So he became huge in the business. This guy and you became huge in the business is running colleague,
Herschel Weingrod 43:05
Matt Davis and Tova felt you anyway. So the good news is, oh, any hire a British director named Ken Anakin did world war two movies he had a 10 year for like, us, us dialogue, Americans dialogue.
Alex Ferrari 43:25
So it's just a win win win all around. Yeah.
Herschel Weingrod 43:28
So anyway, before this movie comes out, of course. It's in the trades. It's been announced. These guys wrote this comedy script. It's really funny. It's going around, it's getting made. And all of a sudden, we're getting meetings and getting awkward because now we're comedy guys.
Alex Ferrari 43:46
They have to put you in a box. Exactly what. Which brings me to my next question. Have you produced another film in the 90s that I absolutely love, which is so off your filmography? far,
Herschel Weingrod 44:00
I'm so proud of them. I mean
Alex Ferrari 44:02
It's falling down with Michael Douglas. The I remember being so that trailer was so brilliant. I remember going to the theater opening night and watching that and I was just blown away. It was a Joel Schumacher. Film. And yeah, can you imagine that film today getting released by its Do you imagine
Herschel Weingrod 44:26
It's actually pressured. It's it's, it's angry. It's angry white guy.
Alex Ferrari 44:32
It's the angry white guy. He's completely but he's like, angry.
Herschel Weingrod 44:36
He's a Trumpist. He's,
Alex Ferrari 44:38
He's angry. It is such a it's such a brilliant film. And Michael Douglas played it. It's like, why can't I have breakfast? Yeah, it's, it's terrible. It's 1005 We stopped breakfast. It's right there. Just put some eggs on what's wrong with you people?
Herschel Weingrod 44:55
I don't want to be your friend Rick. I just want some breakfast.
Alex Ferrari 44:59
Are those so how did you get involved with the film like that being, you know, the comedy guys?
Herschel Weingrod 45:05
Okay, so we had this, we had an office universal, we had a deal at Universal. We had a, we had, we had a write a certain number of films a year for a couple of years. So we would bring them ideas, they bring us ideas, when we go to work, we choose to both find things that we want to do or that they want to do, and we'll do it. So they also gave us a little, you know, housekeeping, producer thing, first look, you know, production deal, which also entailed they, they hired an assistant for us who's going around town reading scripts that, you know, from the smaller agencies, right. So, you know, every weekend he fief he finds a couple of scripts and we go home, take them off, take them home to read them. And he gave us falling down. And I'm reading it. And I said, God dammit, I wish I would have written this is so good. Now I have to get it made. And Tim agreed with me. And we went into Universal. And they said no. And then we said, Okay, we went to Warner Brothers. And they told us at Warner Brothers that Arnold Coulson had been trying to get it made. He had options that originally. Apparently the option had expired, but he was going to renew it because he couldn't get it made as a feature. He's check this out. He was trying to set it up at HBO, which was a warner company with Brian Denny. Michael tacos.
Alex Ferrari 46:58
I mean, not bad. I mean, I'm not I'm not angry at it. I mean, it's a different film. Yeah. But Brian Denny, he could have pulled off a version of that fill out
Herschel Weingrod 47:10
Exactly. Peter Boyle. No, no. But Joe and Joe
Alex Ferrari 47:17
Of course, but I think he would have done something with it. Yeah, it would have been, but it's not Michael Douglas. No.
Herschel Weingrod 47:24
Okay. So so we go and talk we meet a couple of younger producers up and coming people at Warner's. Lisa Hanson and Lorenzo di Bonaventura. Both became gigantic producers. I was gonna say names, and they were really, they really love falling down. And they they began to send it out to all these Ailis directors, Peter Weir and guys like that. And nobody wanted to do it. Nobody wanted to. Finally they got it to see AAA and CAA represented Michael Douglas and Joel Schumacher and some other people in the cast, not Robert Duvall, but uh, you know, they basically packaged it. So Joel, I think was the godfather of Bruce Berman's. One of Bruce Bruce Berman's children and Bruce was head of production at Warner's. So he brings Joel and Joel wants to do it. And Joe had never done anything like this before
Alex Ferrari 48:35
The DC cab. I remember I remember. Flatliners I liked I love Lila I love DC cab. Okay.
Herschel Weingrod 48:47
DC cab and then you know Mr. thing that he did younger
Alex Ferrari 48:53
What is the vampire when he did. Oh god.
Herschel Weingrod 48:55
Wasn't there a young vampire thing? He did? I don't know. I mean, but you see, Joe's films
Alex Ferrari 49:03
Lost boys. What am I Yeah, another classic lost boys.
Herschel Weingrod 49:07
I mean, Joe, Joe was very stylish surfaces. He had a really, really good I mean, Joel was a window dresser at Henry Bendel's in New York. I know before before he got into movies, right anyway,
Alex Ferrari 49:24
But falling down. That was one thing I remember from falling down is the color grading on that the color timing on that film was gorgeous that that red orangey la you can smell the the the air that talks in that LA
Herschel Weingrod 49:38
That first scene on the Harbor Freeway was the honking and the that's all that's like right up. You know, Fellini? It is
Alex Ferrari 49:49
It is you're right! You're absolutely right. It was it was it's a brilliant but well now I know the story. Because I was going through filmography I'm like, get the hell How did these guys
Herschel Weingrod 49:59
Okay so But unfortunately, Warner said, but you see, okay, look, you guys can produce it, but Arnold Copeland still has to be on board because you see, he had it first. But more importantly, he's just finished the film for us that we're releasing next year that we think is going to be really successful. So we don't want to offend him. It's called the fugitive,
Alex Ferrari 50:25
Fugitive. And you know, I write, I knew where you're going.
Herschel Weingrod 50:29
So, okay, so they so they partner us up with Arnold. The late Arnold Copas. Yes. And we're in charge of okay, there are some notes from the studio and friend from Joel about revisions, which, which we then give to the writer who's, who's really smart guy, Evie bro Smith. He was an actor before that. And a playwright. And he actually executed them even better than what we could have imagined. But then we give that version to Arnold. Arnold sends it out a title page, only his name is on it as the producer who wish she continued to do all the way through the production all the way through the credits. He had the credits shot produced by Arnold Coulson, and then there's the next card says personal Weingarten to me the hair. It doesn't say produced by
Alex Ferrari 51:42
You just had your names on it, but no credit.
Herschel Weingrod 51:45
Okay, so then.
Alex Ferrari 51:48
Herschel Weingrod 51:49
All the way through, he's trying to cut us out. You see. I mean, we weren't on that sentence. But I mean, he was on the set every day but I mean, anyway, so he mix up. So I get on the okay we we get a big time lawyer who deals with who has deals with Warner Brothers name will go unnamed. Our law firm at the time. And we get we get we get Warner Brothers on the phone. About going to have to reshoot the credits because contractually, it says we have a separate card that says produced by Well, they say we have a policy. We don't have separate producer cards for every single producer. And I said, Well, Mark, you should look at your film Glengarry Glen Ross sometime right? Because there are separate cards for every single producer on that. I love the movie by the way, I love it. So if you did it not too long ago, you can do it again. So they have to reshoot the credits but once again now it says produced by Arnold Cobo soon the next card says and Hershey
Alex Ferrari 53:11
But if you still didn't get it produced
Herschel Weingrod 53:13
But and but but listen to this so But Joe was so upset that he had to go back in and reshoot the credits he said I don't understand you guys your credit is right before mine I said yeah. Joe but your says directed by one of your car just came up and said Joel Schumacher. What craft services maybe it's craft services. I'm learning by using a written by Produced by and then Josha market. Well, what did that guy do? Doesn't say he was pissed. My another late late Joel Schumacher. I've worked with a lot of people were no longer here but just
Alex Ferrari 53:53
So you could talk you could talk all sorts of smack it's great. No. Gleason ball. Paul Gleason for training places and Breakfast Club. Oh, good, Lord. Now I have a very serious question for you about one of your other projects. How could you write dialogue for Bugs Bunny, Porky Pig and Michael Jordan all in one script? That's a skill set, sir.
Herschel Weingrod 54:21
Okay, so had a watch about 20 years of Looney Tune cartoons. Let's Aiden's just to get the ear right about about how each of these characters speak and, and, and how they behave. Right? You know, I mean, you I mean, I've a pretty good year. I mean, I thought I thought putting that and all that kind of stuff. I can do that. I can I can do Daffy and I can do bugs. Porky Pig and
Alex Ferrari 54:52
By the way before you continue, we're talking about space jam the original that's what for anybody listening like what is yeah, it's the movie space. champ very big hit with a little known basketball player named Michael Jordan. Yeah, so
Herschel Weingrod 55:07
Warner Brothers, they actually have a looney tune Police Department. Where if if you're going to, to have any, if you're going to use any Looney Tunes characters they're going to read, they'll say, no, no, he'd never say that. Fox would never say that bugs. I'll never do that. And I had, I had to point out well, actually, in this in this cartoon he did, he did say, the research. Yeah, I had to do some research. But there's a lot of fun. That was also a rewrite. And we didn't have an ending until Michael Jordan decided to retire from minor league baseball and go back to the NBA. And all of a sudden, all of our problems were solved.
Alex Ferrari 55:56
Right! Because he exactly. So he helped you with the ending, essentially
Herschel Weingrod 55:59
Ofcourse, he wrote it for us.
Alex Ferrari 56:03
And that was another massive. I mean, that was a pretty massive hit for Warner Brothers. Very, very massive hit, and I argue, is a little bit better than the remake. That's just my personal opinion. I was forced to watch the remake with my children. Okay, if I was during the pandemic when they came out, so to be fair, but the thing about you also with that movie was directed by another legendary director, Mr. Joe pitka. Now, before we continue, yes, I have 100 Joe pika stories that I love.
Herschel Weingrod 56:38
I love I love him.
Alex Ferrari 56:40
If you can say any of any Joe pitka story, publicly,
Herschel Weingrod 56:44
Oh, that Well, that's
Alex Ferrari 56:46
We could sit we could talk about it offline, or over a drink at the entrepreneur festival. But is there anything you can say publicly, because Joe is an infamous director, who was one of the most talented commercial directors, arguably, in history up there with Ridley Scott and me and David Fincher and those kinds of I mean,
Herschel Weingrod 57:08
He had he had a reputation when he worked on commercials of having a temper and a little bit to ban verbally abusing people. And he's and he's like, six, eight and Polish guy from Pittsburgh with a
Alex Ferrari 57:28
Very large, imposing,
Herschel Weingrod 57:31
Large imposing, man. That's right.
Alex Ferrari 57:33
And he was I mean, I was working with when I got started in the business as a director, I came up as a director, as a commercial director and the commercial business. Oh, so I just heard in the we're talking about the mid 90s, to late 90s, early 2000s. Joe pitka. is I mean, it was great. He Oh, so did he work? Was it a little bit different in the, in the feature film? Well, I didn't hear anything about Wow, he worked in the feature.
Herschel Weingrod 57:59
Nothing. I mean, nothing bad happened at all. I mean, he's, he's a teddy bear.
Alex Ferrari 58:04
And he really, it was just a client he didn't like,
Herschel Weingrod 58:08
And he was great as well. I mean, okay, I can say something nice. Later on. He and his wife, they're like, they open this this incredible, I think French restaurant. It's like a gourmet chef. His wife is right. And he says huge gourmet of French food. I mean, high end Michelin star stuff back in the day.
Alex Ferrari 58:32
And he was brought on because he did the I think he did the commercial versions of it was in there the commercial? Well, you see Bugs Bunny, and
Herschel Weingrod 58:39
That it came out of some McDonald's commercials, I think with Bugs Bunny and Michael Jordan. Right. And maybe it was Coca Cola. It was something like that. And And those were so popular that all of a sudden, look, Warner's had not made a feature with the Looney Tunes, and I don't know, 40 years, right? Since World War two problems, one of those propaganda features.
Alex Ferrari 59:04
And they brought Joe and that's in that's such a classic studio thing. Like who did the commercials. Let's get him to do the feature because he had never done a feature before. He never directed a feature before Perez. So it was just but he did like every Superbowl commercial. Like he was the biggest commercial director in the world.
Herschel Weingrod 59:20
I mean, okay, so, here's a really good story. So when they brought us on, okay, so Michael, Michael Jordan's agent, David Falk was was was one of the big movers of this project. And he represented a lot of other great NBA players. So anyway, they, they come to us and they said, Okay, so we love your script. We'd love your rewrite, but okay, so casting so who do you want to be the Monstars? What's your wish list? They said, Well, Charles Barkley is done. How about Patrick Ewing? On Muggsy Bogues he's short funny. Done. Shawn Bradley seven six called the stick the big, skinny white guy from BYU. Yeah, you're gonna have him okay, so who's Michael play? Yeah. Who's Who's Michael playing golf with net? You know when he like falls down the hall I said, Bill Murray and Larry Bird, John. Watch.
Alex Ferrari 1:00:29
By the way, it's so funny. I'm literally in the middle of watching last dance again. Because I just love that documentary. It's Oh, yeah. Amazing. And watching those guys. Like as we're talking all those guys are fresh in my mind because they see them on the Dream Team. And oh, yeah. And I just saw the new documented the redeem team on Netflix, which is all about when we lost the the Olympics and then the year after Kobe went back with with the other ones and wanted again and what they had to do. But it's yeah, those guys were just, it was a different time. It was just such a different time.
Herschel Weingrod 1:01:03
I was we actually went to that golf course it was in Lake Arrowhead. When they shot that scene. It was really fun.
Alex Ferrari 1:01:10
Oh, so you're talking about and
Herschel Weingrod 1:01:13
Improvising Bill Murray was a great improviser is a great improviser. Because because he actually wrote the line. Okay, so when, you know, he's trying to hit up Michael and saying, Look, you think I can, you know, I can dribble and I can't jump that great. But like I could, I could shoot? I mean, do you think there's any chance I can make it in the NBA and Michael Jordan says notice, and Bill says it's because I'm white, right? Whereas whites, Larry's not quite. There. He's clear. Bill Murray made that it was great. What a great line. Larry's not white make very clear here
Alex Ferrari 1:02:01
Is translucent. herself. I could keep talking to you for hours, but I'm going to ask you a few questions. I ask all my guests. What advice would you give a screenwriter trying to break into the business today?
Herschel Weingrod 1:02:17
I keep a little posted on my desk. It goes something like this. Inspiration is for amateurs. Sit down, shut up and get to work.
Alex Ferrari 1:02:31
It's a good piece of advice,
Herschel Weingrod 1:02:32
You know? Well, the other one is, a lot of people say write what you know. Wrong. What did Shakespeare know about Verona? or something's rotten in Denmark? You think he spent a lot of time in Denmark? Or The Merchant of Venice? Was he like? did some research? I don't think so. No, don't write what you know about right what you care about.
Alex Ferrari 1:03:00
And three of your favorite films of all time.
Herschel Weingrod 1:03:03
Vertigo. Cuckoo's Nest. Yeah. Dog Day Afternoon.
Alex Ferrari 1:03:13
I mean, you can't go wrong with any of those my friend does are all those are all good ones to have on the list without question.
Herschel Weingrod 1:03:19
I mean, I have.
Alex Ferrari 1:03:21
I mean, I mean, hundreds of hundreds. But yeah, those are the three that come up today. And you and so one other thing. You and I are both going to be at the little little film festival that could the Austin film festival here in Austin coming up in the in the month. I love your story. You told me off air. Can you tell me how you got involved with the Austin Film Festival all those years ago?
Herschel Weingrod 1:03:43
Well, I was reading about how there's this Film Festival in Austin. It's the only one that's devoted to screenwriting. So I thought, well, I'd like to go and be a part of that at least watch it. So I found the name of the founder. And she's actually still running. Barbara Morgan. She's fantastic. And I wrote her and I introduced myself and I said, Look, your your festival sounds fantastic. I'm very supportive. I'd like to volunteer my services. off, I'll fly myself out and put myself up and if you want to put me on some panels or something, I'd like to be involved and see what it's like. And she said, okay, and that was about 2003. And I've been going ever since we can't get ready, because they cover a little breaks. They keep asking me back.
Alex Ferrari 1:04:41
They can't get rid of you.
Herschel Weingrod 1:04:44
Oh, they have good. Listen, there's a barbecue pit in the airport. So how bad could it be? Right there. And that's not even Austin's best, but it's pretty good.
Alex Ferrari 1:04:56
It's from what I hear. It's one of the best barbecue is out here. Oh, questions? Yeah, I mean, there's worse places to go is what you're saying.
Herschel Weingrod 1:05:07
The other thing that's great about Austin is it's like nowhere in Texas. Nowhere Texas. You're in Berkeley.
Alex Ferrari 1:05:16
Exactly. People like oh, you move to Texas. I go, No, no, no, no, I moved to Austin. Completely different world. It's like,
Herschel Weingrod 1:05:23
I mean, yeah, I mean, you're there. So but I mean, other people don't know. I mean, you walk into a local Gift Store, even in the airport that had some of the T shirts say Keep Austin weird.
Alex Ferrari 1:05:36
Absolutely. And that and something about the bats and it's a hippie. It's like, we're all the crazy creative artists of the last 50 years. 60 years in Texas, all gravitated to the it is Berkeley it is it is San Francisco. San Francisco.
Herschel Weingrod 1:05:55
Yes. Berkeley. It's, it's an arbor back in the day, I suppose once upon a time.
Alex Ferrari 1:06:02
I mean, it for anybody who's ever been to Miami. It's a little bit different than Gainesville, or the rest of the rest of Florida is a general statement. Miami slightly different. Yeah. Well,
Herschel Weingrod 1:06:12
I mean, you don't see a lot of rednecks in in Austin.
Alex Ferrari 1:06:17
That much. No, no, no, go
Herschel Weingrod 1:06:20
You have to go out to the hill country. I suppose you got to
Alex Ferrari 1:06:23
No farther. Further, further, further, further further. But listen, it's been a pleasure talking to you and I look forward to catching up with you here in Austin when you come to the Austin Film Festival and thank you from the bottom of my heart for being a part of so many amazing films that have helped shaped my my youth my friend so I appreciate you so much, man.
Herschel Weingrod 1:06:47
Thank you, my friend. I enjoyed it.
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